Surging to Brookings

Indeed, Korb and Bergmann hit the nail on the head. Ken Pollack, while inhabiting the body of a rational human being, was enormously responsible for selling masses of his fellow citizens on a false and delusional--and now disastrous--adventure in Mesopotamia. It is past time for those of us who fit the Korb/Bergmann description to get up in the face of some of these monumental fools, privately and publicly, and cast some of them from the podium of vastly self-important tribunes. In other words: Ken--STFU, pal. Just sit down and let the grownups who have to clean up your mess get on with it.

I do see to recall a lot of talk a few weeks ago about how McCain's crying for more troops were just a cynical ploy to avoid responsibility for any results of Iraq. Do you still believe that?

Tony v, only the shadow knows...but here's what: McCain's position is going to be a lot less politically attractive if Bush calls his bluff (or embraces his flinty tough-guy wisdom, if you prefer that locution) and sends more American soldiers into Iraq. Whereas if McCain's call for a "surge" remains hypothetical, it will always be a rallying point around which those who fancy themselves more macho and patriotic than the rest of us can righteously hyperventilate about the stab in the back that came when the weak masses failed to see the wisdon in this further folly. Cynical? Quixotic? I for one would not presume to say--although McCain did just kiss Jerry Fallwell's ass, so one could make a case either way.

Shrug, it's just funny. I see MY and Ezra and Atrios talking about how they know what Bush wants because they actually take him at his word, as opposed to the mainstream media that gives no credit to policy pronouncements. But then with McCain, it must all be a clever ploy.

Or maybe, McCain, being an ultra-hawk, actually believes that more US troops can in fact turn sh-t to gold.

Good for you for posting this, and esp. the useful link to the AEI presser.

Like other Iraq hawks, Ken Pollack accuses other Democrats of "asserting that there would not be any consequences from withdrawal in Iraq." That's a cheap sophistry and he should know it: most of my friends prefer Gen. Odom's finding that get out or stay in, it will be a mess either way. Of course, that requires KP to 'fess up to his role in creating the mess.

Dan Tompkins

Iraq is why a parliamentary form of government is so flexible. The war's supporters and architects want all of the power and none of the responsibility. The general tenor of the war's supporters is fast becoming. "If you don't help me out from my mistakes, there will be hell to pay."

To the pundits: You blew it. Shut up.
To the officeholders: Resign. Let someone else take over.

Are we talking about the same Brookings :)

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/20/opinion/20ohanlon.html?ex=1324270800&en=a96710ca1038e71d&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss

December 20, 2006

The State of Iraq: An Update
By NINA KAMP, MICHAEL O'HANLON and AMY UNIKEWICZ

Although it has been said before about previous new years, it seems very likely that 2007 will be make or break time in Iraq.

For Brookings, we find 2007 will be the make or break year in Iraq, after each of the last 4 make or break years. So, we have now another fine attempt to help make or break Iraq at Brookings since the other ones evidently didn't make or break Iraq. Brookings is what sort of authority on what, why?

"Brookings Institution, an erstwhile left-of-center think tank,"

I always thought Brookings was a centrist think tank, not left-of center.

Brookings is a left of center research institution.

But the difference, at least for economic research, is
that you can trust it to actually do good research and allow the facts to generate their own conclusion rather then the other way around.

Certainly my general approach to life is to listen to well-respected experts, then where their advice turns out to be terrible keep on listening to them rather than turning to different voices, so I don't see why one would have any doubts about this.

The thing that makes it even worse is that Pollack transparently is motivated not just by his desire to, as he always seems to put it, do the right thing in Iraq, but by a desire to try to salvage victory in Iraq simply to rehabilitate his own reputation. It's totally repugnant.

At what point do we stop describing the disgraceful and execrable Brookings Institue as a "liberal" institution. The crap that pours out of Brookings could be bottled by Bush and sold under his own label.

"But the difference, at least for economic research, is
that you can trust it to actually do good research and allow the facts to generate their own conclusion rather then the other way around."

Well said. The Foreign Policy Program at Brookings is one of six programs. The other programs include people like EJ Dionne (Gov. studies), Peter Orszag (economic studies) and Alice Rivlin (Metro).

It is not unimportant to credibility of progressive public policy to take the time to make this distinction.

Judging by the responses, it's ineresting how short of a memory span we have. I seem to remember a lot of people on the left, annd certainly those fitting in the realist camp, proposing withdrawal a year into Iraq back in 2004.

Assuming liberals and realists did have better anticipation of the possible failures in Iraq back in 2003, they certainly seemed in 2004, and still do seem today, much more interested in schadenfraude and "I told you so's" than actual viable solutions for the welfare of the Iraqi people.

Even if the Neocons are trying to engage in some sort of Machiavellian redemption, the tendency of the anti-war camp from the outset in the face of first signs of vindication to ignore any decent reconstruction strategizing (that is, back when troubles first began in 2004) in favor of some sort of pullout is both morally repugnant and intellectually vapid.

tony v,
The difference between mccain and bush is that bush is president and can actually implement policies.

Certainly my general approach to life is to listen to well-respected experts, then where their advice turns out to be terrible keep on listening to them rather than turning to different voices, so I don't see why one would have any doubts about this.

how many times does an expert get to be wrong before they are not an expert any longer?

Brookings is very concerned with centrist cred. On foreign policy in particular this has led them to be more or less conservative, just a shade to the left of AEI.

re: Josh @2:42

The point about support of a pullout is that there isn't any chance of success militarily. The Iraqis, once we've gone, won't be any more mutually murderous than the Sri Lankans who are also in the middle of a prolonged 3 way civil war. Where is the call among "realists", neo-cons, etc to stifle the Sri Lankan urge to kill their kindred? There isn't any. Ditto Darfur.

There's a myth going around that there's a magic amount of force that will solve this. Or a proper time to have done this which we missed. Would an American intervention in the late 80s, when Saddam was at his bloodiest, have been successful and avoided this? Would 500,000 troops have done the trick in 2003?
(I suspect that the general who recommended a humongous number of troops was simply using the salt-the-bird's-tail gag to avoid going in at all.)

Commenter "Josh" reaches into his neoconservative grab bag and pulls out the phrase "intellectually vapid and morally repugnant." What's next, "clarity"?

Josh seems to be arguing that our calls for withdrawal in 2004 made us...what? Indecorously prescient?

As they say in the blogosphere, "the stupidity burns".

Go enlist, Josh, you wanker twit.

MQ:

So you read their minds at Brookings and detected frail egos needy of "centrist cred"?

Can we dispense with this subjective and unprovable notion that Democrats and other allies voted for the Iraq invasion and vote to keep it going out of a desire to seem "tough"? The argument, aside from being mind-reading, is rather tautological. Seem tough to whom? To people who have the power to punish them for not adopting the "tough" line.

How about a simpler explanation: the foreign policy guys at Brookings have the same outlook as AEI as far as invading Iraq and attacking Iran and advancing Israeli strategic interests. They're "neoconservative". They just use a Democratic-leaning think-bubble, I mean, think-tank, to further their ends.

I call bullshit on the notion of "centrist cred".

...much more interested in schadenfraude and "I told you so's" than actual viable solutions for the welfare of the Iraqi people...

This is so much bullshit. The Iraqi people are irredeeemably fucked. The cat's out of the bag. The cow's out of the barn. The milk's already spilt.

Let me say this slowly so you'll understand: "actual viable solutions for the welfare of the Iraqi people" don't exist. (Read up on Lebanon's recent hisotry for a preview of Iraq's medium to long term prospects.) Contrary to what it can seem like if one follows the American mass media, this country is not populated entirely by idiots. There are many extremely talented and brilliant people thinking about this problem every day, and so far, bupkus. This is not because these people aren't smart enough or aren't concerned enough about the Iraqi people, or because they're too busy removing liberal knives from their backs: it's because good solutions don't exist!!! If they did, we'd have heard about it by now.

Over the next few years, hundreds of thousends of Iraqis are going to die in all kinds of violent ways no matter what we do. This is George Bush's fault. It sucks, but that's the way it is. The only question we have any control over is how many American soldiers are also going to die in Iraq over those same few years. This question is also related to the question of whether or not Afghanistan is going to go the way of Iraq or not. If we don't redeploy some of our troops currently in Iraq to Afghanistan, we may lose both wars instead of just the one that we've already lost.

So don't be a concern troll, fretting over our "schadenfreude". The "I told you so's" you hear exist because, well, we told you so. We told you back then and we're still telling you now and frankly our collective Cassandra sydrome is losing its romantic allure.

Ermmm..."hundreds of thousends" should be "hundreds of thousands". My rant code launched a denial of service attack on my spelling.

Matthew,

I recall that you weren't going to read Carter's new book, because you were put off by the term "Apartheid" in the title.

But I read above:

"Certainly my general approach to life is to listen to well-respected experts, then where their advice turns out to be terrible keep on listening to them rather than turning to different voices..."

Given that Carter engineered the Egyptian/Israeli peace, one would have to call him an expert on the Middle East, so what gives????

So we're now reaching the second point in the conflict at which Haim Saban's investment really pays off (the first being the ginning-up stage, when Pollack was installed at Brookings).

The obvious question is: Who is paying?

Neocon foreign policy mavens, despite their catastrophic failures, seem to enjoy unlimited financial backing. So, who is putting up the money?

Why the fuck are they still respected experts? They need to be run out of town on electric rails.

I wish I could tatoo Korb & Bergmann's comment on the inside of the eyelids of everyone who was gung-ho for this "quick, cheap" war.

The main shortcoming of the neocon vision for this war was the failure to grasp what it means to provide security. It is hard to imagine who the neocons though would provide security after we toppled the government and fired every soldier and police officer in the nation.

The task now is not to "win," it is to simply get a grip. If we can avoid a wholesale loss, that'll be "victory" enough. I'm gloomy about the prospects, and gloomier because no matter the plan the guy in charge is the same guy who led us into this mess, and who dropped the ball at every single opportunity.

We can start the tattooing with his eyelids.

Assuming liberals and realists did have better anticipation of the possible failures in Iraq back in 2003, they certainly seemed in 2004, and still do seem today, much more interested in schadenfraude and "I told you so's" than actual viable solutions for the welfare of the Iraqi people.

We shouldn't be so hard on Josh, it's not like he's the only voice we hear objecting to the I-told-you-so voices because, after all, to do so would require them to take some responsibility for what they've done.

There's no time to look back, we have to un-shit the bed.

We can deal with who shit this bed, and why, and how.. Well, never.

After all, it is impossible to both hold the bed shitters responsible AND care about the future of the people in Iraq, at least those left alive after we're done surging.

Good comment.Thanks admin.

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