The Ickes Factor

I really some day would love to hear a discussion of "what the hell HRC spent $34 million on in 2006", and the idea that Ickes was the only limitation to that spending is weird.

I also have a great distrust of advisors who don't have any specific role, and (claim to) do a lot of vague things. Way too many people would like to see themselves as that. At least articles about Axelrod or Rove have been very specific about what jobs these guys have.

"Unfortunately, I've never really been able to understand the ins-and-outs of the Catalist controversy, but most of the trustworthy people I know who have strong feelings about it don't come away favorably disposed to Ickes."

I also don't know the details, but I think having a parallel effort to Dean's makes excellent sense in the abstract, in large part due to Dean's hardwired inability to get along with all factions of the party, but also due in even larger part to doubts about Dean's ability as a manager.

That said, I've always viewed Catalist with some suspicion solely because anything that Ickes is doing has to be viewed as some type of stalking horse for HRC's Presidential ambitions.

But if Hillary would just be a good party woman and go become Senate majority leader, I'd suddenly think Catalist was an unalloyedly good idea.

"Unfortunately, I've never really been able to understand the ins-and-outs of the Catalist controversy, but most of the trustworthy people I know who have strong feelings about it don't come away favorably disposed to Ickes."

Or to put it another way:

Someone has to be doing something like Catalist. Dean (wrongly) doesn't see it as his job, so someone's got to do it. Ickes is a bad choice because of the chance that he'll use it to benefit HRC. But if not Ickes, then who?

And finally, for those who don't think HRC is the favorite to win the nomination, you ought to take a look at Catalist's client list.

"I really some day would love to hear a discussion of "what the hell HRC spent $34 million on in 2006"

She was buying loyalty for '08.

Petey: totally wrong. Both dean and catalyst are very committed to building databases. The issue, aha, is that when Dean took over the DNC he fired everyone on the tech team and replaced them with his people. A good idea from a “shake everything up” standpoint, but pretty bad from a “institutional memory” standpoint. So Ickes and other Dem leaders hired all these Dem techy people that suddenly were out of jobs.

Also, buying loyalty from WHO? Yes I can imagine many things she did with that money, But I would really like to hear the details.

She was buying loyalty for '08.

Define "finally."

What sources have I (mistakenly?) not been reading that I've never heard of Catalist?

My recollection is that the Post had something about it a year and change ago. I remember it in connection with Soros, I think.

"Also, buying loyalty from WHO?"

Staff. They got the mortgage payment on their vacation homes in '06. I'm sure it goes beyond staff to buying some outside friends, but my guess is that staff is the main thing.

"Both dean and catalyst are very committed to building databases."

That's certainly not the consensus reading of the situation. The general perception is that Dean has been focussed on running his activist program to the almost total exclusion of any focus on the database and microtargeting programs that the Democratic Party needs to have a level playing field with the Republican Party's efforts.

Not being in the room, I fully acknowledge that the consensus reading of the situation could be wrong. But given that we're talking about Dean, I somehow doubt it that it is.

"What sources have I (mistakenly?) not been reading that I've never heard of Catalist?"

Gotta get out of the lefty blogosphere sometimes. The political coverage there tends to be abysmal.

Ben Smith is an excellent guy to be regularly reading, as was true prior to his current Politico gig.

Petey: at this point you're just speculating. I don't expect blog commenters to have done the research on this, I just wish some more journalists who write a bit on why HRC waged the most expensive Senate campaign ever in such a weird scenario (ironically, for a seat she only hopes to fill for two years).

Also “Dean’s attention is on” is meaningless. A database does not need Dean’s personal supervision. The DNC funds a database operation, it always has, and what Dean spends his time focusing on is largely irrelevant as long as that operation is fully employed. It’s like saying the Bush administration isn’t taking apart environmental regulations because Bush himself is too focused on the Iraq War.

To be fair, my tap water is still potable, which is surprising six years in.

"Also “Dean’s attention is on” is meaningless."

I'm using "Dean" as a metonym for the institution he is responsible for controlling. Where Dean spends the hours on his schedule is indeed meaningless.

However, he has focussed the institution he is responsible for controlling toward running his activist program to the almost total exclusion of any focus on the database and microtargeting programs that the Democratic Party needs to have a level playing field with the Republican Party's efforts.

I'm confused, ygelsias. It was but a few posts ago that you were enthusiastically concuring with greenwald's withering description of ben smith as a "right-wing gossip" and the politico as a "substance-free political rag". Now however you reference a piece by ben smith in the politico apparently without the slightest doubt about its credibility.

Isnt it strange how when ben smith writing in the politico produces a story potentially damaging to edwards, whom you clearly favor, then smith and the politico are a "right-wing gossip" and a "substance free rag" respectively, but when ben smith writing in the politico produces a story potentially damaging to clinton, whom you clearly don't favor, then both smith and the politico are serious and worthy of attention.

I was a very low-level sort involved in the Hilary health care fiasco but one thing I am 100% sure of is that Ickes is batshit insane. I think everybody who was involved in health care in the Clinton Admin thought Ickes was a complete nutcase and heavily responsible for the fiasco. Still having Ickes on her team speaks very poorly of Hillar's jusdgement.

Petey: Sure, but the word “focus” makes a lot more sense when it applies to people and not institutions. Which is why our media overuses terms like that. Did Dean fire the data staff and not replace them? Did he pay for data staff but in fact just had them work on activist outreach? No. Again, with the Bush admin analogy. It’s possible that the Bush admin as an institution focuses on Iraq and everyone who works at the Department of the Interior in fact is writing press releases about Iraq all day. But it’s more likely that they are doing what they’ve always done (deregulating), and the media coverage is too busy looking at shiny things to cover it like an institution instead of a person.

In 2004 the Dem database was really bad. This is universally acknowledged. Dean’s response to this was to fire the old team and bring on his own techies. A more reasonable response (in my eyes and many other’s) would be to realize that making a nationwide voter database is hard, and that starting from scratch with techies-cum-political appointees every few years is a bad idea. Thus, Ickes hired all the people who had been fired and gave them more money to finish the job. Now there’s a little competition between the two teams, and that’s not entirely bad, and certainly neither team is ignoring their job.

Clinton is...smart, tough, street-wise, calculated, wonkish, worldly, ambitious, triangulating? All admirable qualities in my opinion!

In fact, Love it! LOVE IT! Thank you, I'll have another!

"In fact, Love it! LOVE IT!"

How fucking weird. We have a Hillary spammer.

I guess we now know what Team Hillary is doing with their cash.

triangulating

Yes, this is just what I'm looking for in a Democratic candidate...

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